Humans vs. Zombies: SMG needs a nerf

[DoctorDapper]

As reluctant as I am to come crying about how something is OP....

SMG is OP. At least, as far as zombies mode goes.

The issue is, since .75, the smg does drastically increased damage in this mode. Before, it was certainly the best weapon choice-zombies take reduced damage, so the rifle and shotgun don't have the RoF or magazine size to kill a zombie before he noms on your delicious brains. So, your best option was to grab the SMG and hose the zombies down and pray they died before they reached you. There was a delicate balance-humans could group up and blast hordes out to reach intel, or the zeds could force the humans to scatter and pick them off, preventing humans from reaching critical mass.

Now, it takes maybe a half a clip to two thirds of a clip to kill a zombie, leaving you plenty of ammo left to hose down his friend, and since killing a zombie completely refills your ammo, there's never any reason to be conservative-just spray them down at long range; they'll die eventually, and you'll get all 100 of the bullets you used back.

This has lead to a very unfortunate process: human team pushes up, stands on top of a the tower closest to the zombie base, and hoses it down with automatic fire. Zombies can't leave past the withering curtain of bullets; their only option is to dig tunnels for the intel, which is such a time consuming and unreliable process that it gives the humans an uncontested win.

Now, it used to be that the best way to combat uneven power balances like this (say, when half your team quits because they're losing/can't figure out not to use guns/humans are teamstacking/etc.) was to dig a hole down to bedrock for the intel and whack and fool dumb enough to drop into melee range with no place to run, buying the rest of your team time to dig a tunnel or something to push for a cap. But even THIS doesn't work anymore. Several times, a human with an SMG as dropped down onto the intel and come face to face with me and my shovel, and they react by hosing me down with bullets and killing me.

Let me reiterate that: A human, with perhaps one or two blocks of space to move in, has become stuck in melee with a zombie who was waiting for them, and won. That should not happen, ever. Despite the ability to superjump and heavy damage reduction, zombies are still hard-pressed to win: On open ground, zombies lose to smart humans every time, which means they have to force humans into melee by digging tunnels and utilizing corners. Stairs kill zombies, you can't sprint to close distance. Cliffs kill zombies, humans have perfect vision of you coming for them and can kill you before you can reach the base and jump to the top. If humans win in melee range too, I really don't see the point of the game mode anymore-there's no contest, just humans endlessly stomping the few people stubborn enough to stick around after getting stuck on zed team.

TL;DR: SMG needs a damage nerf in zombies mode, or buff zombies, or stop giving humans all their ammo and hp back on a kill. Anything to balance the teams out again.

[Paratrooper]

Probably should be suggested to the person who created the Zombie Mode script itself.

Anyway, I totally agree with you. SMGs on zombie mode can kill a zombie in a few quick hits to the head. You could easily grind a horde coming after you. A team of three humans is impossible, let alone >5 of them.

[DoctorDapper]

I would, except it's been impossible to track him down, so I decided to just throw this out here for everybody to see. With luck, a guy who knows a guy who knows a guy, etc. will let the feedback trickle back to him.

Also, it's nice to know that I haven't gone crazy and that somebody else has noticed the drastic shift in power balance in that game mode.

[Fluttershy]

Shotgun was usable before, now its stupid to use anything other than smg that does 20 damage on head shots, which is blatently overpowered. Rifle is a freaking nerf toy, and always has been....The only time rifle is usuable is when you become pseudo human and start headshotting the campers, but that gets stopped quickly when youre 2 hit by smg almost immeditally...zombies in general is unbalenced.

[Frostified]

OMG, I agree with this soooo much!
SMG puts me off playing the zombies game mode ALOT. It is NO-FUN when you can you keep dying because you can never get close to that SMG nest of 10 humans.
And even worse, the pickaxe isn't even a one hit KO anymore, so while you're trying to kill the human you may die from their smg spam.
AND, when the zombies get an SMG and use it, they're litterally unstopabble. Combined with their tough armour.
IMO the zombies script needs a bit of improvements. Where are you Dany0?

[rafcommando1]

I noticed this as soon as i played zombies. i think it would be better just to have more zombies over humans and zombies have normal stats just can use guns. simpler and better. (ACE OF SPADES should be simpler but better all the time)

[Fluttershy]

AND, when the zombies get an SMG and use it, they're litterally unstopabble. Combined with their tough armour.
IMO the zombies script needs a bit of improvements. Where are you Dany0?

Pseudo humans loose super jump and DR. Theyre exactly like normal humans, buildings and all.

[MrHaaaaaaxFF]

Increase the zombie's health to 1500. That would be good. Encourages teamwork.
Also does Pyspades have the ability to modify weapons stats?

[TheGeekZeke101]

Agreed. The weapon stats shouldn't have been changed, period.

[MoleMan]

*facepalm*

viewtopic.php?f=63&t=5192
for a primer.

Shotgun is buggy in that mode and does roughly as much damage as a single SMG round at any range.

Any half-decent zombie should know that their ability to take hits is not intended to run at nests of ten blues stacked together. Listen to yourselves. You're complaining about not being able to take on ten guys at once while running right at them. Every single time I come on the Aloha zombie server, I am one of ONE or TWO zombies who knows A. that you can spade jump, and B. that the key to killing humans is not to run right at them. USE THE TERRAIN TO YOUR ADVANTAGE. THE MAPS ROTATE QUICKLY, so it should NOT be difficult to find cover in any given situation. Given, a team of competent blues can hold down the fort for awhile, but when it comes down to it, zombies have tons more mobility than blues, and don't exploit it.

Zombies don't need a buff and SMGs don't need a nerf in this mode. Players need to learn basic gameplay/teamwork, and if they aren't even paying attention to chat and what not, it isn't going to happen.

Probably should be suggested to the person who created the Zombie Mode script itself.

Anyway, I totally agree with you. SMGs on zombie mode can kill a zombie in a few quick hits to the head. You could easily grind a horde coming after you. A team of three humans is impossible, let alone >5 of them.

All those zombies will be running in a straight direction at their human targets. Do you people even watch zombie movies or play zombie video games? Play like a Left 4 Dead Hunter, not a god-damn shambler. You'll get mowed down.

If anyone wants, I can come online at a certain time and show you the ropes to become a truly fierce zombie. If at all, zombies are overpowered, not underpowered... it's just... difficult to be victorious as a one man army (even if I get roughly 5-8 spade kills every life as a zombie, assuming I don't cap the int).